Zakarian's Fee

[cp1cp2]

Everyone may have known this but me; Albert Zakarian's retainer has gone from $280 to $400 just recently. I spoke with his assistant Andrea and she stated that his time would indeed use up the entire retainer. Many of you may think this is still a good deal, but I must differ. If you merely want to settle, no lawyer should need to spend more than an hour to an hour and a half worth of billable time to complete the transaction. Also, you don't really need a lawyer with as much experience as Mr. Zakarian to merely settle. It has been documented and proven that the settlement offers from DTV's lawyers aren't really negotiable, so almost any civil lawyer will do.

Let me also say that this thread is by no means meant as an attack on Mr. Zakarian. I have great respect for the work he has done, and continues to do, for the cause. However I must take aim at one item stated in his standard reply email and by his assistant. They both claim that his cost is held down due to economies of scale. They also both claim that then number of people that he is helping/defending increases daily. If those two things are true, then economies of scale states that his cost should go down not up. Please don't argue with me on this, as a CPA believe me I know. The cost of researching this situation with DTV is a one-time expense; he doesn't need to re-research every time he gets a new client. So while I respect what Mr. Zakarian does, and also respect his need and right to take care of his family, don't make excuses for raising your price. If you must raise the price, simply do so and explain that you needed to raise it. It really irritates me when people try and make excuses for something instead of just doing it.

Now I’m sure I can fairly say … let the flaming begin.

[cp1cp2]

I think maybe there is some misunderstanding. My statements are not those of a desperate man. A friend of mine is an attorney and will take my case for a reduced fee, so I have that covered. However, he and I thought that it might be a good idea to see what Mr. Zakarian charges since he has a lot of experience in this arena. But $400 is not a reasonable fee to assist in a settlement of this type. However, I do believe that if you are actually being sued, you should pay Mr. Zakarian whatever he requires to defend you.

My complaint is from the perspective of someone who wants to settle, not fight in court. Also, I was expressing that if he wants to raise his price, then he should just do it. Don't try and hide it behind the veil of an economics theory and pretend that we’re all stupid and won’t understand.

[To The Real King!!]

Hi Folks,

I cannot believe what I am seeing here.

We now go from the free TV'ers to the Free lawyer'ers.

What he does for the CAUSE. WHAT CAUSE? lawyers don't have anything to do with any cause and if anyone thinks that $400.00 is too high a fee, please do NOT bother to write me and get my free assistance or mention it. Just go ELSEWHERE.

I have a criminal case and I have spent over $400,000.00 dollars so far and its not over yet. Yes that is four hundred thousand dollars. And if anyone gets out of this with $400.00 as their cost of negotiation, its cheaper than cheap.

How many of you have had other lawyers settle anything for $400.00 or less? ANYBODY?

If anyone finds its too expensive, do yourself a favor and don't say so but just go elsewhere. This is not a proper forum to be discussing a private matter such as legal fees anyhow and I will not accept any more posts on this involving private matters like PRICE.

Case closed. If people want to post go ahead but I do not think that dollar amounts should be mentioned. Client-lawyer relations are supposed to be kept between two people so please lets keep it that way.

People also need to learn that price is in the eye of the beholder. Some people are woolworth people and others go to Tiffanys. When the price is NOT suitable, no smart assed comment is necessary. Just DO NOT take the offer and go ELSEWHERE.

I don't often get annoyed but this type of thing pisses me off ROYALLY. It shows a distinct lack of class and is ONLY a reflection on the poster. I am sure that Mr. Zakarian would be pleased to negotiate with everyone separately but I think his fixed price is a hell of a deal. And anyone who does not need not publicly criticize it in this stupid way. Just don't hire him. And if you think he is expensive then go and get your own lawyer. People should please have just a LITTLE CLASS, PLEASE!!!

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To The REAL King!!

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[morgana]

Good lawyers and those that are experienced or even partners in law firms bill usually near $700.00 per hour CDN. That is about $450.00 USD. Now yes many of the law firm associates will bill alot less, but the more experienced the lawyer the more he bills per hour. So since you may think that this is so easy to do and requires little know how, you can find out those who have just recently past the bar. You probably will get these guys for arounf $150.00 per hour. That is pretty much as low as it gets. Its your case and your money. I would think you would want it spent wisely.

One to two hours is what a lawyer will need to spend to negotiate the deal and have it typed up and presented to you. Plus of course any of the costs such as long distance calls etc. Some one here needs to do some math, before he puts his fingers to the key board. This thread is in very bad taste to say the least.

[cp1cp2]

I find it interesting that you say some people go to Woolworth and some go to Tiffany's. My friend that I spoke about earlier works for a law firm called Mayer Brown and Associates, one of the most prestigious law firms in the country. Their standard fee for my case is $300! Because they know that little effort is required to reach a settlement in a case like this. And yeas it's low because they will have the new guy work on it, but you don't need a tenured attorney to work out a settlement. The difficulty comes when you walk into court. Then you need the best, and you should pay whatever it takes to get the best. You also state that a lawyers' fee is private. Normally I would agree, but Mr. Zakarian's fee has been well publicized here and by himself. Therefore there shouldn’t be a problem posting it. I absolutely do NOT expect a lawyer to work for free, and NEVER said or implied that. Do not put words in mouth! What do you mean he hasn't done anything for the cause? His tireless research, flat fee, his recent post to this site, and sending information through you, are all helping the cause. Maybe you, TTRK, should change your tune to "I'm not a lawyer, but I play one on the Internet". And you morgana, telling me to do the math. Maybe you missed the part about me being a CPA, believe me I can do math. And I did a lot of math and research before I posted. In fact I have actually spoken to several lawyers about this matter to get their opinions and fees. While some charge well over $400, most (about 80%) were willing to take the case for less simply because they have dealt with it before and know what it takes. That my friends, is economies of scale. My post was not, and was reiterated, not about the fee, but about the reference to economies of scale. His fee structure is supply and demand based as suggested by thepoet. Like I said before, if he wants to raise the price then do it, I understand, but don't veil it falsely. In fact when I talked to Mr. Zakarian about 3 or 4 weeks ago his price was $280 because of economies of scale, now it's $400? The economic theory hasn’t changed in hundreds of years let alone in 3 or 4 weeks. You do the math.

One thing I said that I would like to retract is my comment on $400 being too high for a settlement. That is for everyone to decide on their own. I was merely stating what I have discovered in the Chicago area. And if Mr. Zakarian feels that the time he will spend and has spent is worth $400, then that is his right and I support that. My original post was about the reference to economies of scale. As a business professional I get irritated when people/companies veil things behind theories instead of coming right out and stating the real reason. I only felt that Mr. Zakarian should be more forthcoming and realize that his previous PUBLIC price was $280 and is now $400 violates the economic theory he quotes. I believe that most of the people here are not stupid, maybe a little hot-headed like myself, and would have understood his need to raise his price without trying to hide it.

[morgana]

You really do get my blood pressure up.

You say that these lawyers charge less as they have done this before? Just how many DTV settlement cases have they done? DTV's lawyers are all top notch and they will drag out each settlement just to run up the legal bills. Just because you say you want to settle does not mean they will allow it. If you get a cheap snotty upstart going after these guys, you will soon see the case go to trial. Each case is not as simple as picking up a phone and saying I am representing XXXXX and since I am a lawyer you will settle because I say you have no case.

Each case a lawyer gets will be different. Some will be for ISO programmers others many be for programmed cards, or other hardware. They will have to research just what all this is and what uses it has. This forum has supplied much of that needed info for lawyers and has cut down research time immensely. The lawyer may well have his staff do all this research but he is still going to have to make himself knowledgible of the fact and issues. He will then have to spend a fair ammount of time with the DTV lawyers as they will not easily give up. So just to read all the issues here that may apply to the case will take several hours by his staff. They will give him the condensed version to bring him up to speed. He will prepare for either a meeting or phone call to DTV lawyers and find out just what they have for evidnce and convince them that settling for a much lessor ammount is in the best interests of all. This will take time, as he also need to pprotect you from criminal liability and many other things. This will all have to be agreed to and then he must prepare a written submission, that will have to be okayed by DTV lawyers, and then you will have to sign it.

You have to have trust in the lawyer to make sure he has protected you against any and all further actions. It is not just as simple as saying, ok I will pay this and you will end this civil action. I will not do it again and agree to ....... The cost to defend a criminal action because your lawyer was trying to do a quick down and dirty settlement, will be hundreds of times more expensive then the $400.00 fee here.

You should let your friend defend you. But just think on this for a moment. It just maybe, that Zackarian has rasied his fee due to the fact that he has done many of these cases and knows that each one will take several hours of time. The guy you want to go to probably has never done one settlement with the DTV lawyers, so his retainer may well be exceeded, when he finds out just how dragged out these settlements can be. You seem to have decided he raised his fee, for no other reason then wanting more money. Either way I wish you luck with who ever you decide to use.

[gunsmoke2]

$400.00 seems like a real bargain to me. One lawyer I retained was $15,000 and another was $10,000. In 1997 I retained a lawyer for $2500. and there was no work til a year later...I wanted to have a lawyer in case I had a problem which I did in Nov 98.


My lawyer charges $4,000. just to appear in court whether its an hour or five hours... I have retained lawyers in New York..Florida.. and Ohio and they charge between $250. to $500. an hour..


GS2

[REDx]

i tend to get myself into
civil matters that require
an attorney a couple times
a year. 400.00 for a resoltion
of a matter is very cheap.
i also have a very speical
friend who is a attorney she
does federal cases.
ill give you this all the cases
i have known of that were resolved
the monetary portion has been 1,800
without exception. the part that is
different is the agreement that
is signed.
thats where it gets tricky.

[Salty Jizm]

Hey cp1cp2... As long as you are stirring the pot, here is something for you to complain about: Why don't you make a post complaining that TTRK's posts are too long. If he really cared, he would condense his information down to just the few sentences that we need.

I'm sure the Free-TV crowd has better things to do than read his ENTIRE post!!! Think of all the people you could help if you could get TTRK to just post those one or two sentences that we need!

[cp1cp2]

morgana, why do act like getting to a settlement is so difficult? I have several friends who have settled and have had a lawyer contact Yarmuth on my behalf already. In ALL cases Yarmuth has stated without probing or prodding, that they would settle and for how much. The settlement amount came out within the first 15 minutes of conversation in all cases. The only person I know who had any iota of trouble was someone who bought dozens of programmers and a hand full of unloopers. And still Yarmuth did agree to settle after about 3 phone calls that totaled an hour of billable time by his lawyer (yes I saw the invoice). Also, you do not need to be very knowledgeable about ISO or any other technology in question to perform a settlement. The reason being, DTV is unwilling to bargain so you take the settlement or leave it. It doesn't take Perry Mason to work that out. I do agree with one thing you've said though (look, a break through), you do need to trust the attorney you hire.

Oh yeah, don't forget your blood pressure medicine.

[cp1cp2]

Salty, while I agree that his posts are long (as are mine sometimes) he usually has a lot to say and therefore needs the space. So I say go on with the long posts, and if people don't want to read them they can scroll down I guess.

The real reason for this post is that you reminded me of something I wanted to say. There appears to be an impression that I am or was a freetv'r (and am now accused of being a free lawyer'r). I never was or am a freetv'r. It's pretty tough to be a freetv'r when I haven't ever received TV for free, except from that antenna on my roof.

[gunsmoke2]

Shame Shame on you for complaining that TTRK's posts are too long. TTRK spends so much of his time to help so many people he doesn't even know. What benefit does he receive..


Alot of members come here to read his very helpful posts. Alot of people including many lawyers visit his site legal-rights.org. Do you have any idea on the amount of work and effort goes into legal-rights site. What benefit does he receive from the free informational site..


Shame Shame on you..



GS2

[Evildss]

The posts TTRK make are excellent and provide much info, if u think they are too long then don't read them and go elsewhere!!:mad:
You probably haven't gotten a letter, but u definately deserve one and then u would appreciate his posts, but then again some people are just like that :R

Go Away ;)

[WECU]

For those who feel that $400.00 for the experience he has gained and all the knowledge he has in already dealing with DTV is high. Go somewhere else, do not sit here and relay your attitude online. Just go somewhere else. Many persons here help many in a variety of areas, this attorney is only one of thousands, but this attorney is close to the case and possibly where it will be appear in court. From what we have read he just does not demand you to settle, but asks your situation and then determines the best course of action.
When you have a attorney who does divorces do you want to go to someone who does bankruptcy no, he has worked for several months now with DTV and their attorneys. He has gained experience and understanding how they work so far, remember in life you get what you paid for. Four hundred dollars is still very resonable and for piece of mind a bargain for all his knowledge.
Just our two cents.

[stranglehold]

Originally posted by cp1cp2
In ALL cases Yarmuth has stated without probing or prodding, that they would settle and for how much. The settlement amount came out within the first 15 minutes of conversation in all cases. The only person I know who had any iota of trouble was someone who bought dozens of programmers and a hand full of unloopers. And still Yarmuth did agree to settle after about 3 phone calls

FYI for anybody that cares.

It took Yarmuth AT LEAST a week(more like 17 days) to get back to my lawyer with a settlement offer, which was over DOUBLE what an individual who had contacted them directly (WITHOUT COUNCIL). They were accusing us both of purchasing 2 or less devices. I am told that Yarmuth looks at the specifics of each case - this is by no means a "standard" process.

I believe they are trying to squeeze more money out of people that hire council because the people that hire council appear to have more money to give. It just appears that DIRECTV and its lawyers are stretching and abusing the system to the very limits!!

[morgana]

CP1CP2
If you really think that is all there is to it, then why even hire the lawyer. If they settle in less then 15 minutes and make the settlement number without prompting, I would have to say you are really getting the sweetest deals around. But lets just say that you are right and the phone call lasts 15 minutes. Do you think it ends there? You have to dictate the terms to be written up and then make sure you have added all the proper clauses that will protect you from further action, and make it so you have not now given them an admission to have criminal charges laid. This I will say is going to take another 15-30 minutes. The law clerk will draft it up and the lawyer will double check it again for errors for another 15 minutes. Then they will have to get you to sign it and forward it to DTV lawyers so they can accept and sign it. This again will all take time. The lawyer is well over an hour and his staff may well have 2-3 hours involved. So yes even if we take your simple 15 minute call, which I do not believe is the case, the lawyer will still have many more things to do.

I am happy that you say you have already had your lawyer contact DTV lawyers and your settlement is in the works. That is good for you. I just hope you are 100% correct in your feelings that this was all done, so nothing more can and will come of it. I also realize that in most of the agreements they have a clause thay you can not speak to anyone about this and if you do you will have breached the agreement and again be open to prosecution. So I am glad you have told us this before you signed it, as after it will just unravel all that you have done.

Good Luck.

[zkt]

It makes sense that the more proficient you become in whatever you do, the more compensation you are justly due for your effort as compared to those who offer the same service at a decreased level of competence. Those who do the job better are justly due to be paid more for their proficiency.
On the other hand, as one becomes more knowledgeble and competent in his endeavors, his efficency will increase and he will spent less time on any one individual project thereby reducing his per/unit costs.
The question then becomes; what is a reasonable value for ones services in a particular market.
ThisisAmerica. The homeland of capitalism. Everyone has a right to pursue economic success by virture of their inate talents so long as they do not interfere with the same rights of others.
Dtv has clearly crossed this line.
Although I do not know Zekarian personally, my gut feeling is that he does not run with that croud.

Zkt

[kene1024]

It just boggles my mind that this thread even exists.

cp1cp2, if you feel Mr. Zakarian is too expensive, feel free to find some other attorney. But believe me when I tell you (from very recent personal experience) Mr. Zakarian knows what he's doing, he knows what he's talking about, and he is worth the money, regardless of whether it is $280 (which I personally always thought was too low anyway) or $400. For reasons that are probably obvious, I cannot
and will not provide any more details but, in my opinion, your money won't be wasted on Mr. Zakarian.

But, as has been said time and time again, whatever you do is up to you - it's your money...you can spend it now, or (maybe) spend lots more of it later.

[To The Real King!!]

Hi Folks,

Firstly I want to say on behalf of MANY MANY defendants who have contacted me and who are VERY satisfied with their dealing with Albert Zakarian, THANK YOU SIR!!! You have been INDISPENSABLE to this community. and we all thank you for that. And I hope you will continue to assist as long as assistance is needed. Thanks Al.

Mr. Zakarian and I talked about this, realized that there were a large number of defendants who needed help, and he put together an extraordinary package of assistance at what was an EXTREMELY low price. He felt he could do it for this and that it would help many people. I really commend him on this somewhat un-lawyerly action. Normally lawyers go for as much as is possible or practical.

But after some experience with the issue, it did not work out financially and the economies that he had (somewhat optimistically in my opinion) hoped for DID NOT materialize. So rather than dropthe assistance package, he raised it to what DID make sense.

Now frankly he does not NEED or want all this public discussion of something that should either be accepted or rejected and he is quite annoyed by this. I dont blame him. But he is too CLASSY to say much, just that those who do not like the price should try elsewhere. Public discussions of fees are not nessary and if anyone does not like the fee, they should PASS. But to start a public discussion on it, totally unnecessary.

So Mr. Zakarian please understand that 99% of all the E-mail letters I get express SATISFACTION not only with the charges but more importantly WITH THE RESULTS AND THE METHODS OF HOW YOU CONDUCT YOURSELF. So thank you sir.

What you are doing is well appreciated by most and we need not comment further. I will close by posting anonymously the last letter I got today concerning this issue and then I will close the thread. Anyone who needs Mr. Zakarian, I urge you to contact him and if you feel the price is too high, contact someone else. But frankly do NOT expect this level of quality service elsewhere because in my mind it exists here ONLY because of WHO Mr. Zakarian is and his eagerness to assist those unfairly accused. He even mentioned to me that its unfair enough that the innocent are falsely accused so he would like to keep his price as low as is practical so that these folks are not double harmed. He is a VERY FAIR MAN.


Dear ttrk,

You may remember some email from me a couple weeks ago, thanking you for your legal-rights.org site. Just wanted to let you know that Mr. Zakarian was able to negotiate a very favorable deal for me with the people at Greer, Herz, and Adams. I won't ell you the specifics, for fear of breaching the agreement (even though I haven't gotten a copy of it yet) but I wish all those idiots bitching about Zakarian's fee would just go away, before they piss him off and he decides it's not worth the aggravation of dealing with some of the ungrateful idiots that just don't seem to get it.

I truly don't know how you have the patience to tell idiot after idiot the same thing over and over again.

But you have my thanks for your site putting me in touch with Al Zakarian, as he has saved my life. When he called me this morning to tell me the proposed settlement, I think I must have felt like OJ when the jury said "not guilty". I'm not getting off for free, but I'm not going to get hammered for tens of thousands of dollars.

Best wishes to you,
Anon



This is the type of letter I have received time and time again. Anyone not happy with the arrangements I have made with Mr. Zakarian or his wonderfully fair and helpful offer, please just go elsewhere. I also want to point out that people all across America can use Mr. Zakarian to negotiate a deal but if it comes down to going to court, he will be of MUCH assistance to a local lawyer who would represent you and STILL save you money. But in most cases he is able to negotiate satisfactorily without going to court.

And to anyone who believes he can do better, please do so quietly without public spectacle.http://www.legal-rights.org/images/ttrk.gif

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Thanks & Good Luck,
http://www.legal-rights.org/images/rotate_rib.gif
To The REAL King!!

Freedom has nothing to fear from the truth!
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