What to do with your freakin letter

[drod12]

This post is to give comfort to all of you that have received a letter from DirecTV. I will spell the facts for you so maybe you can sleep at night.

First here is what DTV is doing with these letters.

They started mailing out these letters in July 2001. They are mailing 1000 letters per month. They have gotten your name and address from a dealer that they shut down and have SETTLED with out of court for a monetary sum and the dealers customer records. In all cases the suits were settled and no convictions or judgements rendered. The timeline for these letters follows,

1st letter - Scaring you to call their Attorney (Collections Agent) to respond to them within 14 days.

2nd letter goes out 30 days later if you do not respond giving you another 10 days and also includes a FAKE LAWSUIT that they just insert your name into. DO NOT mistake this for a Summons.

AFTER 2nd letter if you do not repond? NOBODY REALLY KNOWS WHAT HAPPENS.

If you read thru this forum you will see lots of advice. But what you have to remember is this. NOBODY HERE KNOWS WHAT HAPPENS AND WHAT TO DO. Most of the people that post here are asking questions and the same few are replying. The problem is that most of the responses are from the same people who either dont have a clue what they are talking about and have not gotten a letter and all others are DAVE Moles playing the mind game to scare you to respond. You can pretty much tell who they are by their posts. ALL NEGATIVE. You would think that they would at least not make it so obvious. KEEP IN MIND - I have been monitoring this site for about 4 months now and HAVE NOT SEEN ONE POST FROM ANY ENDUSER THAT WAS SUMMONED OR TAKEN TO COURT OR HAD A JUDGEMENT PLACED AGAINST THEM.

What to Do?


One thing to remember is that everyones situation could be a little different based on what you bought and how you paid for it and if you have an active sub with them or not. BUT Most are in the same boat. DAVE has 'Business Records' that list what you bought and when and probably how you paid for it. ONE THING TO REMEMBER THESE RECORDS DONT PROVE ANYTHING. NOT EVEN WHAT YOU SUPPOSEDLY PURCHASED.'They could produce an invoice that said you purchased drugs!' doesnt mean it happened. That is why no matter what you do DO NOT CONTACT THEM BY PHONE AND IF YOU DECIDE TO CONTACT THEM DO IT IN A WRITTEN CORRESPONDENCE DENYING WHAT THEY ACCUSE YOU OF AND IF THEY DECIDE TO PURSUE LEGAL ACTION THEN YOU WILL COUNTERSUE. I have a feeling that most of these Supposed Lawsuits that you see posted here are most likely people that responded to them and confirmed to them what they bought which just helped their case immensly. Im sure they just love it when somebody calls them back from a letter and tells them that the Unlooper, Bootloader or Programmer they purchased is a legal device. You just did a major foul up because you just confirmed what they suspected you bought.

I know 3 people personally along with myself that received these letters over ONE YEAR AGO and nothing happened to them or me. NOTHING. One of these people purchased a programmed card and programmer and had it sent to his address where his account was with DTV. Now this seems to be a clear cut case of being guilty but nothing happened. IMAGINE THAT! There are alot of posts of lawsuits from PACER files posted here. Nobody knows the circumstances of these posted cases from PACER. They could be dealers, Websites or people that were stupid enough to purchase a programmed Card which would be hard to prove a legal use for or they could be BS.


A Good course of action is to respond back via written correspondence stating that you deny you purchased any such device and you deny their allegations and if they choose to proceed with a judicial action then you will see them in court with your attorney who you will instruct to counter sue. You could also just ignore the letter and wait to see if a summons ever appears. my guess is it wont and you shouldnt waste your sleep on this matter. At least if you send a letter you wont give them any information and your letting them know that you intend to fight them on the matter if they pursue it.

Remember if DAVE had a clear cut case against you the authorities would have been to your house to charge you criminally which is not going to happen. There is also alot of rumor about ignoring the letter and getting a default judgment against you. IT CANT HAPPEN unless you get served by the court and do not show for your court date so dont worry about a default judgement.


In closing I want you all to know that DAVE is using all of this as an ANTI-PIRACY PR game. They will not take somebody to court with a weak case and risk a loss because they have alot more to lose then you. In Most cases all they can legally sue you for is $10,000 and legal fees so that is their best case scenario. Most End-Users dont have those kind of assets so they would most likely get nada and they know this. BUT IF THEY LOSE JUST ONE CASE. Imagine how that would play out. DIRECTV tries to sue end-user and loses. That would send a very bad message to the public, You can pirate Satellite TV with no consequences. There is a reason that they are mailing 1000 letters per month till they are done, They want to drag it out and make their PR PRESS RELEASES to the papers about all the pending lawsuits. Mr. Mercer who is DTV's spokesperson just a few days ago released a statement saying that there are over 300 individuals being sued all over the country. Lets stop and do the math. 1000 letters over the last 15 months. thats 15,000 end users and only 300 lawsuits. Do you mean to tell me that 14,700 people settled with them. GET REAL! If you get a letter respond and deny or just ignore. If they are willing to sue you let them take it to court and wait for the summons then get an attorney involved. Remember DTV has a history of Settling all of their lawsuits out of court so wait until you need an attorney and let him do his job. But Rest Assured it will most likely never get that far and if you would like to get back at them well the best way is to affect their bottom line. Tell 10 people how this company has treated you and that Dish is the way to go and have them spread the word so on and so on.........


Good Luck and God Bless.......
drod12

[aj666]

?

[drod12]

Trust me, If DAVE was Suing everyone that ignored the letter and everyone that rejected their settlement offer there would be alot more of these supposed end user lawsuits. And for this going on for over a year now and only a few reports of end users lawsuits coming up I think alot of people are panicking and blowing this way out of proportion which of course is DAVE's plan. For what it is worth I have read all of the news posts that are floating around the web in regards to these lawsuits and all seem to be people that were involved in a criminal case due to a sting operation by law enforcement or people that have purchased actual modified Access Cards which I would understand would be a little more difficult to explain. I Have yet to See ONE instance where somebody received a civil judgment against them for a programmer. Sorry but all the evidence I have seen on these various forums and news articles is it all looks like a big PR sham. Come on people we dont live in Nazi Germany or Communist Russia. This is the Country where you have rights and people actually have to PROVE that you have done something wrong. Remember the burden of proof is on them not you and all they have is a piece of paper from a third party which lists some kind of product. did your invoice say 1 illegal device used for satellite decrytion... any attorney will tell you that this whole debacle is a major scare campaign on their part and for the most part is working......

[thepoet]

Originally posted by drod12
...Most of the people that post here are asking questions and the same few are replying. The problem is that most of the responses are from the same people who either dont have a clue what they are talking about and have not gotten a letter and all others are DAVE Moles playing the mind game to scare you to respond. ...

So, drod12, with your total of two posts, which category do you fall into?

[HW_Girl]

Drod12

Thanks for your post! You have answered my question - which was a hard one to get answered. I share your beliefs. I CANNOT imagine WHY people are willing to hand over a settlement ($3500) because of a "letter of threat". In these forums, the same thing has been said, but here is my thought; would a criminal POST his plans for breaking the law? Probably not, unless they WANT to get caught - or unless they are incredibly stupid!

I realize it doesn't "look" good to buy a programer, but hey you can still buy bongs - it doesn't MEAN your smoking dope. Or better yet, you can buy guns - it doesn't imply that you intend to kill someone! Granted chances are if you have a bong in your closet, you're probably smoking an illegal substance. But I haven't heard of anyone getting served for buying a bong, nor I have heard of anyone getting a warrent BECAUSE he bought a bong.

The only problem I worry about is IF it does go to court. Court is based on emotions, not black and white nor facts. So even if one CAN "prove" they weren't using a programmer for receiving sat signal, if the judge thinks the person looks funny or the jury sees a booger in the defendants' nose, they can "find" them guilty. This could get expensive, in both time and money! So I can understand why a lot of people ARE choosing to settle. I can also understand why people aren't posting what is happening too. If this scares one and one gets out - I highly doubt they would go back to these forums to "chat"! AND the others, just don't chat.

My BIG question, too, IS has anyone REALLY been served!? Maybe we'll never know! Good points though!

[freetv4mee]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by drod12
...Most of the people that post here are asking questions and the same few are replying. The problem is that most of the responses are from the same people who either dont have a clue what they are talking about and have not gotten a letter and all others are DAVE Moles playing the mind game to scare you to respond. ...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

thepoet wrote:
"So, drod12, with your total of two posts, which category do you fall into?"

LOL ...but seriously, drod writes a good post. There are obviously one or two moles in here bent on perpetuating the myth that dave's gonna get you if you don't respond, via a lawyer, to the letters. I think drod is like me, he probably hasn't gotten the letter yet but knows somebody who has. To which I say thank you for taking your time to offer your opinion, without needing the letter to motivate you to write.
He only has two posts now, but two good posts IMO!

[JD490]

Here is a post from zeta7 says he was sued
http://www.dsschat.com/forum/showth...threadid=132386
He says he is part of the Florida case. Haven't seen any more post from him. There has not been any other post that I have seen here where they said they have been sued. They are not dragging everyone into court that's obvious. If you feel your case is strong I would just sit back and call there bluff. Most of you will settle if you get sued. I have received the letter too.

[jeepmanhunter]

This makes more sense than anything I've seen on any site.

[REDx]

drod lol well most post i have
seen here tell people to consult
a lawyer.when you recieve the letter.
i would say a mole would want you
to.
A)ignore the letter's so dtv could
get a default judgement.
B)call or write dtv yourself.
Hmmm i see you recomend writeing dtv
yourself.
me i say contact a lawyer if you receive
the letter.

[mrself_destruct]

Hate to break it to you guys but DTV has filed over a hundred suits against end-users in the last 2 months. Now the messed up thing is that EACH suit names about 10-15 defendents at once! Almost like a reversable mini-class action suit against end-users.

So let's say you have 100 lawsuits filed....and 10 defendants named on each lawsuit...that's 1000 people already sued! Their tactic is obvious....wait until you have enough people to sue in each Federal Court district to make it very cost-effective and bam a flurry of suits in each new district (as the trend has clearly showed). Now, a NASA Space Monkey can figure out there's probably alot more people to be sued in the coming months....if they can file 100 lawsuits with 10 defedants each month...they could hit the 15,000 letters they've sent out in 15 months, give or take a few.

NOW, by pointing this out I am by now means advocating settling or any other re-action to the letter...just pointing out the facts as they stand.


Originally posted by HW_Girl
Drod12

Thanks for your post! You have answered my question - which was a hard one to get answered. I share your beliefs. I CANNOT imagine WHY people are willing to hand over a settlement ($3500) because of a "letter of threat". In these forums, the same thing has been said, but here is my thought; would a criminal POST his plans for breaking the law? Probably not, unless they WANT to get caught - or unless they are incredibly stupid!

I realize it doesn't "look" good to buy a programer, but hey you can still buy bongs - it doesn't MEAN your smoking dope. Or better yet, you can buy guns - it doesn't imply that you intend to kill someone! Granted chances are if you have a bong in your closet, you're probably smoking an illegal substance. But I haven't heard of anyone getting served for buying a bong, nor I have heard of anyone getting a warrent BECAUSE he bought a bong.

The only problem I worry about is IF it does go to court. Court is based on emotions, not black and white nor facts. So even if one CAN "prove" they weren't using a programmer for receiving sat signal, if the judge thinks the person looks funny or the jury sees a booger in the defendants' nose, they can "find" them guilty. This could get expensive, in both time and money! So I can understand why a lot of people ARE choosing to settle. I can also understand why people aren't posting what is happening too. If this scares one and one gets out - I highly doubt they would go back to these forums to "chat"! AND the others, just don't chat.

My BIG question, too, IS has anyone REALLY been served!? Maybe we'll never know! Good points though!

[drod12]

Destructo dont forget about the 2 Year Statute of Limitations in Federal Court and DTV received the Customer Lists on or around 5-2001 so unless they file a crapload and speed up the mailing of their supposed 100,000 end users they will lose their litigation window in about 6 months.



drod12

[REDx]

it hasnt been determined yet when
the clock starts ticking on the
statue of limitation's.
just for the record the criminal
statute runs 7years for purchaseing
a signal theft device. more to the
point owning a signal theft device
isnt a civil actionable act.
useing it to intercept and decrypt
the signal is. you being the expert
you already knew that right.

[mrself_destruct]

They've only sent 15,000 letters out, so I dont think 100,000 end-users is in play. Plus many, probably most will settle before the suit....so the actual number they will need to file is much less, however they have until May of 2003.


Originally posted by drod12
Destructo dont forget about the 2 Year Statute of Limitations in Federal Court and DTV received the Customer Lists on or around 5-2001 so unless they file a crapload and speed up the mailing of their supposed 100,000 end users they will lose their litigation window in about 6 months.



drod12

[BubbaHill]

Sec. 2520. - Recovery of civil damages authorized

(e) Limitation. -

A civil action under this section may not be commenced later
than two years after the date upon which the claimant first
has a reasonable opportunity to discover the violation.

------------------------------------------------------------------


Sec. 507. - Limitations on actions


(a) Criminal Proceedings. -

Except as expressly provided otherwise in this title,
no criminal proceeding shall be maintained under the
provisions of this title unless it is commenced within
5 years after the cause of action arose.



(b) Civil Actions. -

No civil action shall be maintained under the provisions
of this title unless it is commenced within three years
after the claim accrued.

[crownvic]

http://www.nolo.com/lawcenter/ency/article.cfm/objectid/0566BBF3-858F-4E25-89F7A06B61F9CEF5/catID/DCA1178C-B579-49DC-AECDFCB8A7E9A20B#7DD7E706-6214-4CCB-A4CE24F1BC504ED4

[Lager]

Originally posted by REDx
drod lol well most post i have
seen here tell people to consult
a lawyer.when you recieve the letter.
i would say a mole would want you
to.
A)ignore the letter's so dtv could
get a default judgement.
B)call or write dtv yourself.
Hmmm i see you recomend writeing dtv
yourself.
me i say contact a lawyer if you receive
the letter.

A good lawyer will tell you to ignore it until you actually get served process.


Lager

[REDx]

well i have not spoke to all the
GOOD lawyers out there lol.
the ones i did speak to all
said it was not a good idea
to ignore a letter from any
law firm, accuseing you of a
criminal act or a civil actionable
matter. i have ethter by email or
phone spoke to most of the attorneys
listed by TTRK.they do not agree with you
that the letters should be ignored.
if your GOOD attorney told you in your
case to ignore the letter then YOU
should. if you are harmed by following
there advice then you can take action
against them.

[drod12]

REDx, such a lot of negativity and criminal statutes coming from somebody that has already consulted an attorney and obviously knows first hand how to deal with 'The Letter' Why dont you just start a thread and tell all. When you got your letter, what your attorney did in response and finally how much was your settlement or if you didnt settle when did you get your summons?

Frankly I am a little leary of anybody that likes to mention anything about a criminal action and quotes criminal statutes and what COULD happen. Looks to me like a DAVE mole which I guarantee are among us.

Unfortunately I created this thread to give a little insight to the many people out there that have received this bogus letter and just want a course of action. Instead this thread is filling up with the same baloney as all the others. DONT IGNORE OR THEY'LL SUE, IF YOU DONT SETTLE THEY'LL SUE. IF YOU CALL THEM THEY'LL SUE, GET AN ATTORNEY OR THEY'LL SUE YADA YADA YADA. Obviously from what is said around here THEY'LL SUE NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO so why not take the approach that I'll do NOTHING until I do actually get sued and then get and attorney and let him deal with it. But the odds are you'll hear NOTHING, It will just go away like DAVES subsciber base and in a few years from now you'll laugh at how worked up you got over a stinkin letter.

One thing to remember is if your sued or settle youll need an attorney regardless to protect your rights. You can always settle after they file if you think you dont have the stomach for it and you'll most likely have a smaller settlement than the $3500.00. DONT BELIEVE FOR A SECOND THE NAYSAYERS THAT SAY SETTLE NOW OR YOU'LL HAVE TO PAY ALOT MORE LATER. Do you really think DTV gave you their best offer as their first offer. HARDLY NOT.


OUT!

drod12

[zennn]

"One thing to remember is if your sued or settle youll need an attorney regardless to protect your rights. You can always settle after they file if you think you dont have the stomach for it and you'll most likely have a smaller settlement than the $3500.00. DONT BELIEVE FOR A SECOND THE NAYSAYERS THAT SAY SETTLE NOW OR YOU'LL HAVE TO PAY ALOT MORE LATER. Do you really think DTV gave you their best offer as their first offer. HARDLY NOT. "


That is absolutely true. Even if you settle and adhere to their extortion, you will still need an attorney to make sure there are no loop holes for any further incriminating tasks. I have not received the letter but a handful of my collegues have, after consulting with various lawyers the consensus is among them to ignore the letter in which they have. I'm not saying this is what "you" should do. Every case could be different depending on time of purchases, quantity of purchases and place of purchase.



Peace,

zennn

[mrself_destruct]

Drod,

Has anyone advocating settling here? I think not....we're just pointing out the facts....and the facts show that Dave is sueing people, hundreds of people within the last two months.

Now since the letters started going out the conventional wisdom and advice was to ignore them...well now people are being sued, so perhaps that advise should be questioned. Responding to the letter (especially the second one) does not mean settling or admitting to anything. Responding with an attorney can mean:

a) finding out what "evidence" Dave has
b) denying the allegations via your attorney
c) playing hardball: challenging their absurd allegations and threatening a counter-suit and/or fight.

or a myriad of other methods of dealing with this

This is what some are doing. Whether this results in suit anyways or gets Dave of our backs remains to be seen.



Originally posted by drod12
REDx, such a lot of negativity and criminal statutes coming from somebody that has already consulted an attorney and obviously knows first hand how to deal with 'The Letter' Why dont you just start a thread and tell all. When you got your letter, what your attorney did in response and finally how much was your settlement or if you didnt settle when did you get your summons?

Frankly I am a little leary of anybody that likes to mention anything about a criminal action and quotes criminal statutes and what COULD happen. Looks to me like a DAVE mole which I guarantee are among us.

Unfortunately I created this thread to give a little insight to the many people out there that have received this bogus letter and just want a course of action. Instead this thread is filling up with the same baloney as all the others. DONT IGNORE OR THEY'LL SUE, IF YOU DONT SETTLE THEY'LL SUE. IF YOU CALL THEM THEY'LL SUE, GET AN ATTORNEY OR THEY'LL SUE YADA YADA YADA. Obviously from what is said around here THEY'LL SUE NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO so why not take the approach that I'll do NOTHING until I do actually get sued and then get and attorney and let him deal with it. But the odds are you'll hear NOTHING, It will just go away like DAVES subsciber base and in a few years from now you'll laugh at how worked up you got over a stinkin letter.

One thing to remember is if your sued or settle youll need an attorney regardless to protect your rights. You can always settle after they file if you think you dont have the stomach for it and you'll most likely have a smaller settlement than the $3500.00. DONT BELIEVE FOR A SECOND THE NAYSAYERS THAT SAY SETTLE NOW OR YOU'LL HAVE TO PAY ALOT MORE LATER. Do you really think DTV gave you their best offer as their first offer. HARDLY NOT.


OUT!

drod12

[JD490]

Here is what I have experienced so far with the letter. This may give some idea to people that have not received the letter, but may expect one is on the way. I'm going to leave out some details, so I can't be identified.

Received the letter sometime this year. Contacted a local Attorney that specializes in computer and cable/satellite criminal defense. He used to be a prosecutor in this area of the law, so he knows what he is doing. He sends a letter to them asking what proof they have I have stolen satellite TV. They respond that they have no proof I did that, but they have an invoice or information that I purchased a 1 device from a dealer that was busted. They provide the information. I confirmed it is correct. After a few phone calls between them my attorney says they have a very weak case. There attorney even goes as far as saying it is weak also, but they say there client DirecTV wants me to pay them $3500.00 or they will sue me. My attorney gives me the choice call there bluff or settle. He says if they sue and can't find any new information through discovery which I will have to answer questions under oath they will probably loose. We could counter sue for damages. I.E. Malicious prosecution. Going to discovery will cost at least $5000.00 or more. Going all the way through court 10-15k. Now here is another way of looking at settling. If after you settle and get a good agreement and Dtv comes at you again now they really have to prove something or they have breached the agreement. Attorney fees will most certainly be awarded in breach of contract. If you want to stay out of court settlement is the easiest way out. If you have nothing to worry about in discovery, and have the cash to fight I would call their bluff. It won't be cheaper to settle if you wait to get sued unless you go through deposition's and they get nothing new. Decide before you get sued. He also said he finds it very unlikely that DirecTV will in the future try to have a prosecutor come after me. The evidence is too weak and just signing the agreement wont give them any new evidence unless you send them some devices.

[REDx]

drod12 if you want to know were
my head is on this matter read
this thread. http://www.dsschat.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=15

[giveupdave]

You sound more like a mole telling people to ignore the letter. Yea, great idea, now DTV will get a default judgement.


Originally posted by drod12
REDx, such a lot of negativity and criminal statutes coming from somebody that has already consulted an attorney and obviously knows first hand how to deal with 'The Letter' Why dont you just start a thread and tell all. When you got your letter, what your attorney did in response and finally how much was your settlement or if you didnt settle when did you get your summons?

Frankly I am a little leary of anybody that likes to mention anything about a criminal action and quotes criminal statutes and what COULD happen. Looks to me like a DAVE mole which I guarantee are among us.

Unfortunately I created this thread to give a little insight to the many people out there that have received this bogus letter and just want a course of action. Instead this thread is filling up with the same baloney as all the others. DONT IGNORE OR THEY'LL SUE, IF YOU DONT SETTLE THEY'LL SUE. IF YOU CALL THEM THEY'LL SUE, GET AN ATTORNEY OR THEY'LL SUE YADA YADA YADA. Obviously from what is said around here THEY'LL SUE NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO so why not take the approach that I'll do NOTHING until I do actually get sued and then get and attorney and let him deal with it. But the odds are you'll hear NOTHING, It will just go away like DAVES subsciber base and in a few years from now you'll laugh at how worked up you got over a stinkin letter.

One thing to remember is if your sued or settle youll need an attorney regardless to protect your rights. You can always settle after they file if you think you dont have the stomach for it and you'll most likely have a smaller settlement than the $3500.00. DONT BELIEVE FOR A SECOND THE NAYSAYERS THAT SAY SETTLE NOW OR YOU'LL HAVE TO PAY ALOT MORE LATER. Do you really think DTV gave you their best offer as their first offer. HARDLY NOT.


OUT!

drod12

[crownvic]

drod12,
RedX has done nothing but try to help folks in these matters and even offered to put up money out of his own pocket.
Your statement was totally uncalled for.
Read this next time before you start typing without thinking..

http://www.dsschat.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=136533

[Speedp3]

^

[CariRN]

I do hope people will concentrate on providing legitimate info to each other and not back biting and fighting. We have to work together. Hopefully eventually develop the class action suit against DTV. I am surprised to see this 10,000 letter number. I thought there were more letters out there than that. Oh well doesn't matter. I had to go see and secure a lawyer in this matter. I am very hopeful that his correspondance with DTV will end this harassment. He told me that the statute of limitations is 2 years (civil and goes from the supposed purchase date to the court case. (I am not sure if that is when the court case is set or the actual date). He advised me to have him send a cease and desist (sp) letter and possible counter to DTV. At best they have a minimal case against me. I wish I had the funds to really fight this. I hope some federal judge (or whatever) would call a halt to DTV's waste of court resources and consumer harassment. I will do everything I can to avoid settling. (It is foolish I think to for sure say I will never settle unless you have a big bankbook). Good luck to everyone. I hope we all keep each other posted on actual findings and developments. And well I for one say end your DTV subs. Pay for digital cable or Dish for now. Send out our own economic protest. DTV Concentrate on NDS instead of small frys.

[freetv4mee]

Alright, I finally noticed this quote button and I'm not afraid to use it ;-)

Originally posted by giveupdave
You sound more like a mole telling people to ignore the letter. Yea, great idea, now DTV will get a default judgement.

...doesn't really hold water but it helped steer me thinking nevertheless.

Any possible earnings won from petty default judgements must pale in comparisan to what dave likely pays in certified mail and legal costs.

Their intent is monetary of course, and they "thank you very much" for your $3500 on those occasions when people unwittingly choose to settle, but I sorely doubt it is the primary purpose of these letters.

This intimidation tactic appears successful as I continually read some of the older posts to better understand some of the people here.
I've decided that this overall letter campaign is very successful in basically scaring the bejeezus out of the vast majority of people here who luckily have little or no experience with the law. Hence, theses persons are so much more likely to pay a lawyer which is not recommended, IMHO, because it implies guilt that might later be used against you if you do in fact continue with this hobby.

On the other side of the coin, it ultimately benefits everyone to know how far to push a good thing without going outside the legal bounds. and I say intercepting satellite signals for testing purposes in my house is my right and I'll challenge anyone from dave's team to tell me I'm not entitled to this form of education. I pay, I don't want "free tv" as my name might imply, but I do want the option of obtaining what you say I can't have.

Statistically, I'd also like to clear up this weak fact regarding these tens of people getting sued: If only ten or fifteen people are actually being sued out of the 1000's of letters being sent, they are probably people who knowingly made traceable money off this hobby, and I'm not talking about gratuity made from "hooking-up" a friend or family member either, I'm talking mail-order programming.

I'm nearing my final thoughts I swear; Lawyers must be slowly realizing that this is the place to make money!
This would further lead to politicians acting on behalf of lawyers to pass even harsher laws on signal theft, giving both legal and dave industries a much broader scope in which to prosecute people, and ensure kickbacks to those same politicians as the perpetual cycle goes.

The mood in the den, I'd like to see, should be more militant in the fact that dave is going far above and beyond the scope of the law in threatening such hyperbolic compensation numbers like $35,000. This should be eventually proven to be the blatant harassmant it is.

I mean, If anybody ever sues me for thirty-five grand, and actually gets it to court, my countersuit will absolutely be for $35Kminimum + legal fees I will then happily use an attorney on contingency.
And I will win the public's sympathy too of this I am confident. I would force this issue beyond any judge in defending my good name in front of my peers. I mean, there is money to be made here as I see it, and at the expense of a corporation that not everybody likes.
Anyhow, I'd welcome the chance to set precedent if you're listening dave. Sorry I didn't order enough supplies from any one dealer to qualify for your "target-list"


And finally, imagine the uphill battle dave would have if 50% if its subscribers magically learned to manipulate access card data overnight. the larger public would quickly recognize the arguments favoring individuals' right to decrypt sattellite signals within the privacy of ones own home.
I will forever propogate my belief that it is absolutely every person's right to decrypt anything being sent to the homes of anyone under the blanket of dave and his satellites' transponders.

Remember, the same advertising revenue that that 20 years ago justified the very existance of NBC ABC and CBS to name a few, because signals were transmitted over airwaves...Free with the hope of viewers buying endorsed products. Times have seriously changed and yet, these cable and sat companies continue to double-dip its customers by way of advertising revenue AND Cable or satellite subscription revenue, the latter being the revenue and technology that at one time promised to do away with commercial television, ...didn't happen I guess?

End two points being:
The minute cable or satellite companies start successfully winning money from individual citizens is the day that cable and satellite companies open themselves up to the wrath of an overwhelming majority of citizen's who think the cable and satellite industries are the biggest racket since the days of AT&T the jugernaut.

number two: The ultimate purpose of these letters is to scare people away from this hobby and this tactic's obvious success in not only reclaiming old customers but upgrading existing customers certainly justifies the continuance of their ongoing letter campaign.

end of my 2am babble babble babble transmission:gg

[fixter]

Very well said freetv4mee. I feel the same way. The radio communications act from the 1920s states that no one can "own" the airwaves. This is what dave is essentially saying, that he owns those airwaves by copyright. I remeber all the hubbub about police scanners, radar detectors and CB radios. I know that there are certain states that have specific laws on these matters as well. The general rule though is that we have the right to monitor the airwaves. I bought my equipment so I can alter as I wish. Just my 2 cents!

[JD490]

My attorney said it is from when DirecTV finds the information that you bought the device. Not from when you bought it. They didn't know about you then. This would be a obvious legal factor in court that could be fought. Now if they discovery when they subpoena all your past bank history for 7 years that you purchased 5 more devices with your credit card that won't matter much after that.

[Lager]

Originally posted by REDx
well i have not spoke to all the
GOOD lawyers out there lol.
the ones i did speak to all
said it was not a good idea
to ignore a letter from any
law firm, accuseing you of a
criminal act or a civil actionable
matter. i have ethter by email or
phone spoke to most of the attorneys
listed by TTRK.they do not agree with you
that the letters should be ignored.
if your GOOD attorney told you in your
case to ignore the letter then YOU
should. if you are harmed by following
there advice then you can take action
against them.


Chuckle. I am fairly certain that the law firms I deal with are a little out of your league. A good lawyer knows that a demand letter is nothing and means nothing. Until you are actually sued you have no need for a lawyer and the good ones won't take your money until they are needed. Why do you need a lawyer unless you are sued? If you want them to mediate a lower settlement for you, then yeah, by all means pay them to negotiate for you. Do not however confuse that course of action with getting a lawyer to actually defend you. Some people do not have the money it takes to defend an action such as this and even fewer have enough to obtain a top tier firm to represent them. For those people it may be better to attempt to settle the suit. That is not a choice I can or would make for anyone. Each persons situation is unique to them. Unlike yourself, I have never attempted to push an agenda on this or any other forum. I cannot recall the numerous times people have called you out as a Dave mole (including myself). My opinions and comments are mine alone, you or anyone else can take them or leave them but I can say my experience in this particular area is most certainly more extensive than yours. Please note the fact that I am not out here posting people should ignore this, throw that away, call or not call anyone. The postings I make here are specific to the post I am replying to and not part of some large scheme.

Lager

[REDx]

me and my friends here at the
trailor court got a good laugh
about the league comment.
ill have you know my trailor is
only 8yrs old.its a airstream to
boot.billy jean down the holler
maybe a sellin his doublewide.
if i put off gettin a set of
those store bought teeth. i just
might buy it. im sure that would
put me in your league. but my boy
friend joe bob just told me he likes
it that i dont have any teeth.so i guess
ill only have to wait another year to be
in your league shucks.

[goliath]

my friend just recieved that summons today with his and two other peoples name on it. all three of them are in the st. louis metro area. but the summons states that dave has proof that they purchased a programmer and used it to illegally recive dtv signal it also stated that the programmer was used to program cards for othe people. HOW WOULD THEY KNOW.

also has anybody got the same letter 3 times. i got my first letter over a year ago then one two weeks later now i recived one 2 days ago.

just thought i would throw this out to see if anyone can relate to it.

i will post again when i know more about the summons.

[Speedp3]

my friend just received that summons today
Is the summons dated?
Does it say when the summons must be answered?

[goliath]

20 days

[Speedp3]

Originally posted by goliath
20 days
The reason I ask, is that the collection agency for DirecTV have been know to sent *sample* lawsuits to people in a effort to scare them into settling. This is not to say that this is the case here. Was the summons hand delivered? Or, served by some other means?

[goliath]

it was dated oct.1st and was deliverd by a well dressed man that works for the law firm that dtv retained. also something i just thought of is that, my letters came from a law firm in texas but my friends came straight from dtv end users dept.

[Mechanic]

There is now an attorney from that area on TTRK's site.
Good luck.

[JD490]

I read another post by zeta7 saying he received 1 letter from Washington state law firm then a sample lawsuit from them a few months later. Then he received number 3 letter from a local law firm in Florida where he lives. Then a few weeks later he received a summons with the same local law firm as repersenting attorneys for DirecTV in a real lawsuit aginst him. If you have received number 3 and it is from a local law firm in your area I would be expecting a summons. This third letter is probably a last ditch effort to get a settlement.

[freetv4mee]

Originally posted by goliath
...the summons states that dave has proof that they purchased a programmer and used it to illegally recive dtv signal.

So, was the programmer used in an emulation setup to receive said signal? and if so, how would dave know? Programmers aren't generally used to receive signals, programmers are generally used to help one see card data via one's computer ;-)

Originally posted by goliath
...it also stated that the programmer was used to program cards for other people. HOW WOULD THEY KNOW?

Sounds like the more dave outsources his legal needs, the more creative the approach of these law firms. If I can legally threaten you to extort $3500 off your conscience, I will legally do it (I wouldn't personally, but to make the point ;-). If I as a lawyer was given the green light to "sue" you I just might push the envelope a bit in claiming to know exactly what you did with your programmer.
Anything goes in making money off of these settlements. Don't settle, make dave prove his allegations. If one is innocent and knows dave can't possibly prove sh*t, one should countersue for all of North America to see. The first one to do it is going to make good bank!