boot strap loader

[partimetom]

I have a friend who bought a bootstrap loader and got a letteris this just as bad as buying a programmer they are used for different things too?

[gunsmoke2]

Any devices that were used to receive DTV services without payments. I personally think that there is no differences between the devices as far as the law goes.



GS2

[partimetom]

what could my friend say he used the bootstap for are their alot of different hobbies these are used for?

[GhostDog]

This is what you might be looking for

Click Here (http://www.sdlogic.com/pcscprod_sdlogic_sdext.asp)

[morgana]

I think it has already been said that the hardware is all viewed as being illegal. If you are not knowledgible enough to know of legal uses, then you should not even entertain using that as a defence. only those who are very knowledgible should even try to defend on these grounds, as trying to dazel them with your brilliance will only get you to pay more and possibly charged criminally. That is not the terrain you want to walk in.

You will be better off pleading total ignorance about the uses of the hardware and showing the judge you really are incapable of doing what DTV claims, then you are at trying to show using these has some higher abilities. This is the time where being unknowledgible, helps you out. Look at it this way, DTV is trying to claim you used this to steal their signals. they really have no proof that you did. They know you would need programs and oyher things along with this hardware to do this. Why in the world would you show them you know anything more then basic computer skills. When asked about card programs, reply with "is that anything like solitair" on your computer. If you want to be a smart ass and show you have more then the requiste knowledge to have done those things DTV claims, well then you had better be able to think and move on your own, when discovery is done. Know your enemy, and if one of the enemy is there when you look in the mirror, then correct that first thing before all else.

[partimetom]

Yess , but when you go to discovery and they asked you why you spent all that money on something you dont know about or know how to use that, might be reaching either way it seems like know easy answer around that.

[bandit73]

I'm curious as to were I can find a list of Item's that are "deemed" Illegal (Iso programmers ,ect, ect) and who deemed them as being Illegal ??

Just curious if anyone knows ?

[morgana]

You can always say you thought, this was something that you could add to the satellite system to enhance it. You never understood the workings and the site never explained how this worked at all. Once you knew this you just put it in the drawer as you could never figure out how to use it, and no one would refund your money for it. The site itself never explained that these were illegal in any way, and you thought that these were just an enhancement to the product that you would subscribe to. If you already were subbed to DTV, this will work well. If you were never a DTV subscriber, you can say you never managed to get the dam thing setup and working as well. So does that mean the DTV system is illegal as well.

Of course this will only help those who bought one thing. Those with several purchases will have to do their own thinking. But unless you are going to devote large amounts of time to becaome an expert in all of this including the laws about it, then do not try and take the legal uses route. It is too easy for DTV to then show to the judege that you really do not have the knowledge to have put this to the legal uses. You have to back up all you say with abilities to do the things you claim to have wanted things for. Yes not everyone accomplishes all the things we start out doing, and a lot can be written off in life to curiosity gone wrong. It is a judge you have to convince in this, and he will make his decisions likely on the impressions you make on him. I feel it is easier to make a case for knowing too litlle. It is safer, as the judge will reason it very possible you learned along the way. When you start at the higher level of knowledge, he will not so easily reason you got dumber along the way.

Play it any way you want, just beware of the pitfalls of each approach.

[mrself_destruct]

This is an excellent defense...very practical and simple, especially the "enhance" part.

Morgana is right...the legitimate use defense (I was programming smartcards for my security door or crap like that) is a big trap that Dave is undoubtedly prepared for.

Another route to take is to deny the purchase. They have to prove you purchased it and actually recevied it before moving on to proving you used it to hack satellite. From what i've seen, Dave's "evidence" is very flimsy. A quickbooks generated invoice or something like that. Even if you bought it with a credit card, ask to see your signature on the receipt. Ask for proof of deilvery...you never purchased/received any device, etc. Challenge the admissability of their so-called evidence. In other words, fight them every step of the way, dont concede the purchase of the bat.


Originally posted by morgana
You can always say you thought, this was something that you could add to the satellite system to enhance it. You never understood the workings and the site never explained how this worked at all. Once you knew this you just put it in the drawer as you could never figure out how to use it, and no one would refund your money for it. The site itself never explained that these were illegal in any way, and you thought that these were just an enhancement to the product that you would subscribe to. If you already were subbed to DTV, this will work well. If you were never a DTV subscriber, you can say you never managed to get the dam thing setup and working as well. So does that mean the DTV system is illegal as well.

Of course this will only help those who bought one thing. Those with several purchases will have to do their own thinking. But unless you are going to devote large amounts of time to becaome an expert in all of this including the laws about it, then do not try and take the legal uses route. It is too easy for DTV to then show to the judege that you really do not have the knowledge to have put this to the legal uses. You have to back up all you say with abilities to do the things you claim to have wanted things for. Yes not everyone accomplishes all the things we start out doing, and a lot can be written off in life to curiosity gone wrong. It is a judge you have to convince in this, and he will make his decisions likely on the impressions you make on him. I feel it is easier to make a case for knowing too litlle. It is safer, as the judge will reason it very possible you learned along the way. When you start at the higher level of knowledge, he will not so easily reason you got dumber along the way.

Play it any way you want, just beware of the pitfalls of each approach.

[gunsmoke2]

I don't think there really is too many who need defenses as how many are really going to fight it in court. Is anyone in discovery ?


Its indivdual choices but it was made very clear to me about 25 years ago not to lie to your lawyer as the result could be worse. I don't know how many have ever gone to court or discovery but from my own personal experience it can be very intiminating especially if you have to take an oath saying you are going to tell the truth, etc.



GS2