eBay's 'Flexiable" Privacy Policy with Law enforcement

[Azuka]

Found an interesting article @ Ha`aretz

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=264863&contrassID=2&subContrassID=5&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

Its about eBay and their 'flexiable' privacy policy. Aparantly they log and have logged every peice of purdent information about a visitor on their site, from selling to buying to feedback, why an account was closed, why an auction was cancelled, all the good information. and if law enforcement wants that information, they don't even need a sopena. Just a fax.

Here's an exerpt

We don't make you show a subpoena, except in exceptional cases," Sullivan told his listeners. "When someone uses our site and clicks on the `I Agree' button, it is as if he agrees to let us submit all of his data to the legal authorities. Which means that if you are a law-enforcement officer, all you have to do is send us a fax with a request for information, and ask about the person behind the seller's identity number, and we will provide you with his name, address, sales history and other details - all without having to produce a court order. We want law enforcement people to spend time on our site," he adds. He says he receives about 200 such requests a month, most of them unofficial requests in the form of an email or fax.

.edit=\
Personally I don't mind the logging that much, infact I've been scammed on ebay (not satellite related) and was very pissed. however. I think they should require a sopena at the very minimum. How long before DTV gets info on all the people selling ISO Programmers with just a fax? Start sending letters to thoes who even just buy/sell the readers that are built into the keyboards (the ones u can't program with) I think there is too much room for abuse here.

[Slam_mm]

A qualified "yes' for me. Legal stuff? Yes. Questionable stuff? Not a chance in hell.

[ELF-CO]

This is no secret. They outline quite clearly what they do with any data sent to them… and by you having an account with them… you have agreed to it all. (Look up their User Agreement to see who can receive what from them)

If people choose not to READ the User Agreement that they sign up for… it’s their problem, not eBay’s. Here is just one quote from their agreement:
Legal requests
eBay cooperates with law enforcement inquiries, as well as other third parties to enforce laws, such as: intellectual property rights, fraud and other rights. We can (and you authorize us to) disclose any information about you to law enforcement or other government officials as we, in our sole discretion, believe necessary or appropriate, in connection with an investigation of fraud, intellectual property infringements, or other activity that is illegal or may expose us or you to legal liability.

Further, we can (and you authorize us to) disclose your User ID, name, street address, city, state, zip code, country, phone number, email, and company name to eBay Verified Rights Owner (VeRO) program participants as we in our sole discretion believe necessary or appropriate in connection with an investigation of fraud, intellectual property infringement, piracy, or other unlawful activity.

Additionally, eBay reserves the right (and you authorize eBay) to communicate any information about you (including, but not limited to your policy violations, ended items, and item status) to other users, law enforcement and VeRO members as we in our sole discretion determine necessary or appropriate to maintain a level of trust and safety in our community and to enforce our User Agreement, Privacy Policy and any posted policies or rules applicable to services you use through our site. The following information is NOT DISCLOSED by eBay without a subpoena:

Area of Interest
Interested in eBay survey
Age Range
Education
Preferred Activity
Household Income
Secondary Phone
Credit Card Number(s)
Expiration date
Billing Address
Bank Account Number
Social Security Number
Billing Account History
IP Address
Cookie
Browser Type
Pages viewed
URL of Next Web Site
URL of Last Web Site
Operating System
Hour of Day
Domain Type
Service Provider
Miscellaneous
Fraud Form (4)
Third Party Service Data

[Azuka]

To be honest, I know if you agree to it, weather you read it or not, then your bound by terms.. Things do bug me like

Nevertheless, eBay does not make do with simply sharing its data with the legal authorities. Sullivan says the company employs six investigators, all of whom have experience in police investigations. Their job is "to track down suspicious people and suspicious behavior." To that end, they scan for patterns that are atypical - different from "normal patterns." For example, if a person sold baseball tickets for two months and suddenly switches to selling a car, the eBay system will "wave a red flag" and signal the seller as someone behaving unusually. Who asks eBay to do it? No one. eBay volunteers.

I don't really want to be 'red flagged' by selling a car after selling my computer stuff, when I can't get them to cancell an account of a (later) known scammer or even give me enuff information to try to persue him to get my money back. Its been 'under investigation' for more then 5 months.

[sanfam93]

well, I just closed my paypal account. as far as ebay go's I never seem to get a good deal so I'm not going to use it anymore.

this is what ebay policy is so if you don't stray you'll be ok.

Satellite and Cable TV Descramblers
eBay does not permit the sale of items that can be used to descramble or facilitate the access to cable or satellite television programming without authorization or payment. Stating the item is for educational or test purposes will not legitimize a product that is otherwise inappropriate.

Information on "how to" descramble or gain access to cable or satellite television programming without authorization or payment is similarly not allowed. eBay policy also prohibits the "encouragement" of this type of activity. If your item is marketed in such a manner, the auction may be ended early by eBay.

Some examples of items, which are not allowed, include:

Smart Card Programmers and Unloopers
Programmed Smart Cards
Blocker Devices
Hardware or Software DSS Emulators
This information is not intended to be legal advice, but we hope it will help you trade safely on eBay. It is not an exclusive list, and sellers will need to take steps to assure their listing is lawful and does not infringe upon the copyright, trademark or other intellectual property rights of third parties.

[ELF-CO]

Originally posted by Azuka
I don't really want to be 'red flagged' by selling a car after selling my computer stuff, when I can't get them to cancell an account of a (later) known scammer or even give me enuff information to try to persue him to get my money back. Its been 'under investigation' for more then 5 months. They state that they have "6 investigators". That should be your first clue as to how long it may take to even get to your case. After all, there are THOUSANDS of new listings each day! And complaints are forwarded to them from people that screen the complaints first... when also adds to the delays. Fraud is so common on EBay, they really need 60 investigators instead of 6.

Just as an example... do a search for a new laptop or expensive digital camera. For every 10 legit auctions... there is at least 1 fraud seller trolling for victims. (Typically the user has zero feedback, and also happens to be selling an expensive digital camera and a plasma screen tv!) EBay can't possibly keep up on all the scams... even with end-user help. This is why they have limited their liability within their User Agreement... and have asked for participation of VERO rights holders and Law Enforcement. They need all the help they can get.

[ELF-CO]

Originally posted by sanfam93
this is what eBay policy is so if you don't stray you'll be ok.You are sort of correct, however... re-read what you typed below:This information is not intended to be legal advice, but we hope it will help you trade safely on eBay. It is not an exclusive list, and sellers will need to take steps to assure their listing is lawful and does not infringe upon the copyright, trademark or other intellectual property rights of third parties.
And now read this quote from their User Agreement:VeRO Program Members are required to be members of eBay. That means they can request information about you just like any other user. Some of them do so and contact eBay users directly about their auctions. eBay is not involved in that process at all. As stated in our User Agreement, eBay also cooperates with law enforcement, and may give your street address to a VeRO Program Member. We never give out your credit card information, except in rare cases when required by a court or law enforcement.Now, with the above in mind... the below link sends you to the "about Me" page of the VeRO member "directv_vero". And since they are a VeRO Member... they act and are treated in a similar manner to Law Enforcement. They (directv_vero) send EBay notices daily to end auctions, and to request for User Info. (Name, address, etc.) EBay will end an auction as per their request because they have to, by law. EBay will also take anything they say at face value.
http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/directv_vero/

And please note that they even state on their "About Me" page the following:The new license agreement specifically prohibits the sale of all P4 cards, and provides DIRECTV with the consent of the user to have auctions of such devices cancelled.Notice that they rarely end these auctions... but you can bet they are getting that user info for future use. You can also bet that if you sell lots of satellite equipment, or any questionable hardware on EBay... DirecTV already has your details in their database. If "I" were going to be selling satellite equipment of any nature, I sure wouldn't use ANY online resource to complete the transaction... and this INCLUDES online banking companies like PayPal. (After all, EBay OWNS Paypal... and their user agreements are uncomfortably similar.

[sanfam93]

Now this is good info.