RCMP Backing off according to this Post I found*** News Article Posted!!

[gunsmoke2]

This is a post from another forum.. if anyone lives in South West Ontario apparently there is a news article..

Please have a look for the complete article

Here is the Post I found:




Hello all...

Some good news here. Seems according to a local paper (full page) article in south-western Ontario the RCMP have taken a sit back and wait position. Due to the recent court rulings in Canada, the local RCMP in this city has gone on the record to state that he (Paul) will not be making any new charges against dealers until he hears from the higher ups. In fact, some of the Stores here are going to start selling DTV units once again. The dealers have gone as far to say they are getting together to look at suing the RCMP for lost revenue for the last two years

GS2

[gunsmoke2]

Was in the Saturday edition of the Winsdor Star. I called them to see if they would fax or email the article.

GS2

[gunsmoke2]

Here it is.. I laid my charm on thick to the gracious lady who took my call :)

EXPRESSPUKE SAYS ITS STILL ILLEGAL.. GET A LIFE YOU PATHEIC BRAINLESS TWITS


By **** Waddell Star Staff Writer:

Emboldened by a string of legal victories in the battle over the legality of
U.S. satellite dishes, at least one local electronics dealer is preparing to
move the battle lines from the courtroom to the sales floor.Tired of not being able to tap into the pent-up demand for American
equipment, Bill McKay, co-owner of Krazy Kelly's, will resume selling the
U.S. dishes next week.In doing so, McKay is risking penalties that could include up to two years in
jail and a $25,000 fine.He admits it's a risk he's willing to take in light of four court decisions -
including two in Ontario and one each in British Columbia and Quebec - over
the last six weeks that have all ruled the U.S. dishes and programming
aren't violating the Radio Communications Act. "With adjudication like this, there's no reason for us not to start selling
them again," McKay said."I've already ordered some dishes from our distributor and we'll have them
here by Monday or Tuesday. I can't imagine anyone being under restraint any
more."Reading these justices' decisions you start to get a feeling of their
righteous indignation. These decisions create a different situation." McKay anticipates a ravenous appetite for the U.S. systems in the Windsor
market that's been building since an RCMP crackdown enforcing a November
1997 Federal Court of Appeals ruling favouring Bell ExpressVu.However, having got a taste of the vastly superior variety of programming
available on the American dishes, many Windsorites are simply skirting the
law by going to the U.S. to make their purchase.By setting up American addresses and joining the "grey" market, area
residents have been able to subscribe to the U.S. services. Others have plunged into the black market, which uses an altered programming
card in the dish's receiver unit. With these so-called "pirate cards," many
Windsorites have been able to view hundreds of channels worth thousands of
dollars a year without paying a dime.Such elaborate measures may soon be rendered unnecessary by the courts. The most significant of the recent rulings comes from British Columbia's
Court of Appeals.That province's top court ruled earlier this month the possession of U.S.
satellite dishes and the purchase of encrypted signals from outside Canada
do not violate the Radio Communications Act.Decisions in the Ontario Superior Court of Justice on Sept. 8, and provincial
court on Aug. 9, also were in line with the B.C. ruling.A decision handed down Sept. 18 in Quebec Provincial Court went even further,
stating cards designed to unscramble encrypted U.S. signals without payment
are also legal."The courts are saying it's legal to sell, buy and watch American programming
on these U.S. satellite dishes whether it's grey market or black market,"
said Port Hope, Ont. lawyer Ian Angus, who is considered one of the nation's
leading legal experts in the satellite television debate."There have been rulings now in B.C., Alberta, Saskatchewan, Manitoba,
Ontario, Quebec and Nova Scotia that are consistently saying the same thing.
"The courts have concluded the laws were intended to protect the Canadian
broadcaster from having its signal stolen."Since the American satellite companies aren't licensed to operate in Canada
and can't charge for their signal, there's no crime in watching the U.S.
programming.Neither Bell ExpressVu or Cogeco Cable returned phone calls to comment on the
latest court decisions.However, in a Sept. 21 fax to its network of dealers, ExpressVu warns them to
ignore the B.C. court ruling.The fax reiterates Bell's position that the U.S. equipment remains illegal
anywhere in Canada and the company will "continue to rigorously oppose the
proliferation of unregulated grey market receivers in Canada. Dealers who
sell black or grey market do so at their own risk."Continued From C1McKay, who sells ExpressVu, points out the long-term risks aren't the sole
concern of dealers. Having lost $300,000 to $400,000 in U.S. dish sales and related business over
the past two years, McKay plans sue the federal government and the RCMP to
recoup his losses."We sold 50 to 60 dishes a week until we stopped two years ago when the RCMP
cracked down," McKay said. "The government has turned the RCMP, a proud police force, into a petty
pursuant of trivialities in this case."Other area dealers expressed equal interest in selling the U.S. dishes, but
none was prepared to commit as quickly as McKay."It was a very lucrative business for us," admitted Gerry Theriault, owner of
Amherstburg's Dynamite Audio and Video."We had a complete list of services because we sold the dishes and set up the
programming through a jobber that allowed you to buy the U.S. programming
you wanted. In our first year, we had 250 accounts."If my suppliers - Toshiba, JVC and RCA - can sell them legally to me, then I
want them in my store. I plan to find out."Waiting gameDon Turner, owner of Turner's Audio Video, plans to wait for all the legal
dust to settle."You won't see any DSS systems here in the near future," Turner said."It would be nice to sell them, but I'm not completely sure of everything
yet. I'm getting faxes from Bell ExpressVu saying there not legal."The government has forced a product people want out of legitimate business
places and it's just gone underground."The cautious approach is shared by the Future Shop."I don't think we want to jump into that fire," said Lori DeCou, the Future
Shop's manager of corporate communications at its Vancouver headquarters.
"We'll sit back and see how it plays out in the courts. Until then, we'll
continue to offer just Star Choice and ExpressVu."Locally, the man caught in the middle of this legal crossfire is Paul
Sheppard.The Windsor-based RCMP constable is responsible for the enforcement of
federal communications law in Es--- and Kent counties."Before I'd lay any charges, I'd contact the Department of Justice and the
RCMP's federal enforcement branch to get guidelines because so many cases
are going Mr. Angus's way," Sheppard said. "I wouldn't prosecute people
willy-nilly in light of what I know from reading these decisions. I'd need
some direction."Locally, the only charges ever laid against any business or individual have
been when police have been on the premises for another reason, such as a
drug bust.RCMP crackdownArea dealers, bars and social clubs largely complied with the RCMP's request
to stop using the U.S. systems after a visit from Sheppard last fall.Sheppard added the RCMP isn't interested in targeting individual home owners.
In light of recent rulings, Angus is attempting to get the courts to prevent
any more new charges being laid."I'm asking the courts to hold back on any new proceedings until the crown at
least gets a win on the scoreboard in one of these cases," Angus said.
"They're getting beaten up in the courts."It's not going to be long before the court gets annoyed with this constant
stream of litigation when these dishes are being ruled legal."However, a spokesperson for Industry Canada, which is responsible for the
Radio Communications Act, said there has been no talk of issuing a directive
to the RCMP to stop laying charges."That's really an RCMP decision," Line Perron said."If they're looking to us for direction, for the moment, there's no change in
our policy. We still believe the 1997 decision is the right one. We believe
it's equal to the B.C. Court of Appeals decision." It's a view that doesn't appear to be shared by a growing number of justices
across the country.Ontario Superior Court Justice John E. Sheppard wrote in a supplementary to
his Sept. 8 decision that the B.C. Court of Appeal decision trumps the
Federal Court ruling."In my view, the British Columbia Court of Appeal decision carries more
weight than the Federal Court of Appeal," Sheppard wrote."This court is not bound by the decision, but that decision is entitled to a
curial deference. I agree completely with the interpretation given by the
British Columbia Court of Appeal."Justice C.E. Haliburton of the Nova Scotia Superior Court was far more
scathing in ruling against the government using the Federal Court decision
to crack down on American dishes."Cuba imposes serious penalties on citizens who attempt to receive radio and
television signals from international sources," Haliburton said. "Such interference is clearly incompatible with the freedom of speech and
freedoms which we have always taken for granted in this country."The steady stream and tone of the recent decisions are causing a growing
concern at Industry Canada."There is no discussion of changing the (Radio Communications) act yet,"
Perron said.Rulings studied"However, the B.C. Court of Appeals decision is having an impact. Right now,
our legal counsels are studying the recent rulings going out from across the
country."Perron estimates there are 40 grey or black market cases before the courts
across the country.Even if the government's viewpoint ultimately prevails, Perron admits it may
be a pyrrhic victory."It's becoming more and more difficult to regulate," he said. "Technology is moving so fast, it's allowing for developments that regulators
never thought of. It's like trying to hit a moving target."The implications of the debate are huge for the Canadian broadcasting
industry, as evidenced by Bell ExpressVu appealing the B.C. ruling to the
Supreme Court of Canada. The Satellite Communications Association of Canada estimates of the 11.5
million households in the country, about 8.5 million are wired for cable.
Approximately a million homes have grey- or black-market satellite dishes,
while the two Canadian satellite broadcasters have more than 800,000
subscribers combined. About 1.2 million homes have TV antennas.Billions in salesThe annual revenue from sales of satellite equipment and subscriptions is
$1.25 billion."There's beginning to be a realization that satellite reception and wireless
technology is beyond the CRTC's control," Angus said. "That's why they opted
not to try and regulate the Internet this spring."This is a last-ditch attempt to maintain the monopolistic practices of the
Canadian broadcasting industry."While the RCMP has seized U.S. dishes from Canadian retailers, Canada Customs
doesn't confiscate American equipment when it's declared at the U.S.-Canada
border.Classified as duty-free electronic equipment, the dishes are subject to
normal sales taxes."At this time, I know of no prohibition on satellite dishes coming into the
country," said Danny Yen, a local Canada Customs spokesperson.If the rising tide of legal defeats continues, it spells trouble on two
fronts for the federal government.The decisions will eventually force the government to try and alter the Radio
Communications Act to close the existing loophole while dancing around the
minefield presented by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms."I think we're only months away from the federal government having to admit
the legislation is flawed," Angus said. Angus added the current courtroom manoeuvring will seem like mere skirmishes
if the Supreme Court upholds the B.C. court ruling."That's when the real fun begins," Angus said."I already have clients lining up asking me when they can sue the RCMP."

GS2

[simple]

This is great news!!!! I will die a happy man knowing that the RCMP and the CRTC cant decide on what and how I watch my TV. Good luck to Mr.Angus and all the dealers that have retained him.I look forward to Bell's and the Government next move. Like a game of chess the one with the best game plan usually wins.

[RiseStar]

Theres BEV in the news again looking like sore lewsers..

[To The Real King!!]

Hi Guys,

I understand Bell are faxing dealers saying that they know BETTER than the law and that it is STILL illegal.

Can someone please fax me this letter at legal-rights.org so that I can try to get the PRESS interested in commenting on that INANE position

FAX: 1-450-451-6477

Please!!

http://www.legal-rights.org/images/niceday.gif
Thanks & Good Luck,

To The REAL King!!
-----------------------
Freedom has nothing to fear from the truth!

http://www.legal-rights.org/images/lrbanner.gif
Now open with lots of useful resources at your disposal AT:
http://www.legal-rights.org


Newbies PLEASE CLICK HERE and Read (http://www.dsschat.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=26)

[RiseStar]

Yes, apparently part of that liberal/bell payoff deal was that bell was above the law...

tsk. tsk.

I will almost bet that John Manley has a complementry lifetime bell subscription...

[gunsmoke2]

I bet you the dishonerable has a US DSS system.. he wouldn't want the PUKING stuff by the PUKES..

GS2

[splash]

Hello all.....

Just a follow up to the article. The local AM (CKLW) station in Windsor had Mr.Angus and the RCMP (Paul) on the radio this morning. It was interesting to hear what they both had to say. But in the end, Paul did once again say that at this time it is legal to own/buy/sell the US systems in Canada, but very illegal to have the cards programed...again sighting section 9.1.c of the act. Well, at that point I had to call in to the radio station ( it is a call in show) to give them my two cents. Point being, how Paul neglected to tell the listeners that the act only deals with Legal authorized dealers. Oppps sorry Paul. Funny how they always seem to forget that small technicality!!!

Well as the article said Krazy Kelly's is once again selling US systems. On the radio programe he stated that he has lost about $200,000-$300,000 in the last two years by not being able to sell the dishes. Seems like a good case to me to go after the RCMP!!!
I just wonder how long before the Bell get there people to change the law to include DTV???

Splash

[To The Real King!!]

Hi Splash,

They can’t do that. You see this section of the RC Act which you can read at

http://www.legal-rights.org/Laws/RC_Act.html

has an exception at 10-2.3 which says

Exception
(2.3) No person who decodes an encrypted subscription programming signal in contravention of paragraph 9(1)(c) shall be convicted of an offence under that paragraph if the lawful distributor had the lawful right to make the signal available, on payment of a subscription fee or other charge, to persons in the area where the signal was decoded but had not made the signal readily available to those persons.

So you see they would HAVE to make it available in Canada which BEV sure as hell does not want. As a monoply (duopoly) company the LAST thing they want is what you and I and every other company has to face, COMPETITION.

These “namby pants“ AH’s cant even do a good job WITHOUT competition, IMAGINE IF THEY ACTUALLY HAD SOME.

You see with 50 years of dealing with government regulatory bodies I think they have become QUITE good at ONLY that issue. And we have some of the “finest Politicians that money can buy“, in Canada.

P.S. Nobody has faxed me the BEV letter sent to dealers yet. Can someone PLEASE fax it to 1-450-451-6477. PULEASE!!!

http://www.legal-rights.org/images/niceday.gif
Thanks & Good Luck,

To The REAL King!!
-----------------------
Freedom has nothing to fear from the truth!

http://www.legal-rights.org/images/lrbanner.gif
Now open with lots of useful resources at your disposal AT:
http://www.legal-rights.org


Newbies PLEASE CLICK HERE and Read (http://www.dsschat.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=26)



[Edited by To The Real King!! on October 3rd, 2000 at 08:33 PM]

[Security Exploit]

Why not give them some competition?

If I had a position like northsat, or some other large dealer, I would simply go wholesale. Any legal problems with this? The dealer that chose to do this could sell the whole package, 3Med H card, dish, LNB, receiver, and ISO programmer. I think a fair retail price would be around $800 for this, or whatever the market would bear.

Being that this is legal in Canada, why not just get it on the shelf at retail stores? I'm sure dave would be pissed, and he might make it more of a hassle for testers, but testers have been winning the war for years now.

Hmmmm.... Rise, I need some startup capital ;) Want to partner up?

[gunsmoke2]

Because we have provided COMPETITION they ( PUKES.. INDUSTRY CANADA MORONINCS.. ROYAL FARCETERS ) have decided to destroy us by UNLAWFUL position that we are breaking the law..

For over three years they have raged a war bent on KILLING THE COMPETITION..

Thats how they deal with it.. and somewhere deep buried its probably in their buisness plan before they (PUKES ) even started up..

GS2

[Security Exploit]

To avoid prosecution by the PUKES, has anyone looked into incorporation in Panama. The laws regarding incorporation in Panama are designed in such a way to protect the true owners identity. The way it works is, wen you incorporate there, you receive share holder certificates. They do not keep any records of the companies board of directors, names or address in any way. Whomever holds the shareholder certificates are the owners of the company.

Because of this, weather a design flaw or intentional, many citizens of other countries incorporate there mainly to hide assets from taxation. I know Canada is more of a socialistic country. Myself as a conservative, I believe in bare minimum tax, and bare minimum services provided by the government. IMO, the government can provide law enforcement and military, the rest can be privatized. Well, I'm getting off track now... When citizens of other countries began taking advantage of this, Panama citizens began capitalizing on this as well. You can hire anonymous remailers there now. This way, you send your products to the remailer, and they ship them along to your customer. And visa versa as well, your customers ship payments, an any other letter to your address in Panama, and it is remailed to you.

There is only 1 flaw I see in this, that is paying taxes, if you pay taxes on the income you earned, you will be pointing out to the government that you are a test card dealer, but if you don't pay taxes, does that make you any better than the PUKES, putting yourself above the law?

Just my thoughts...
Regards,
Jason

[gunsmoke2]

I pay all taxes to the government and make quartly payments of GST and PST.. in fact I have paid a ton of taxes to Revenue Canada when I impost DSS into Canada..

Its mind boggling how much taxes I have paid over the last 5 years on importation of Satellite goods.. I also pay Taxes on importation of virgin DSS cards.. I do not sell test cards but if I did I would charge taxes just the same...

Ocassionally we will sell a virgin access card to someone who preactivates with a subscription to the US provider and we charge taxes on that..

Yet I got raided almost two years ago and they still have all my seized goods.. that I paid taxes on..

GS2