Type of Rg-6

[hifiaudio2]

has anyone seen any differences between regular RG-6 and a "broadband " rated RG-6? I don;t mind paying a premium if it will help performance in any way. Thanks..

[partytyme]

just use the cheep rg 6 the lnb convers the freq down to around 50mhz so ya would be wasting money to buy coax rated to 1.2gig:D

[jeffyjones]

The only diffrence is the price. they come in diffrent braids either 60 percent braid or 80 percent never have seen a diffrence in picture quality.And I do it for a livin.

[thejewell]

Hifi, if your run from the lnb to the receiver is less than 50 feet don't worry about it & use the cheap stuff. However, after 50 feet, use some of the good stuff. You will see less SFSS during poor weather.

[hulon]

any rg-6 wire will work i also install for a living

[thejewell]

hifi, as I said before, if its less than 50 to 100 feet on your run "it don't matter". However, on runs over that then the cable you use "can" matter. For example, on a run of 1000 feet, the difference can be as much as 13dB. Cheap RG-6 can be as lossy as 7.5 dB per 100 feet at 1Ghz. However, a very good grade will run about 6.2 dB per 100 feet. Then as these installers can tell you and if especially you live in Canada (even less signal to start with), 13 dB of loss can make a hellvu difference. The difference between picture and no picture. It just depends on your application.

[hifiaudio2]

Thanks guys, that is helpful - also, i have seen some connectors listed as "weatherproof" that have the sealant on the inside - does this negate the need for applying silicone to the connection? also, how is that applied? i didnt realize i needed to on a previous install, now i am about to put in a high def system and want it done totally correctly the first time

[hifiaudio2]

anyone know anything about those sealed connectors?

[mrrhinehart]

The broadband cable is sweeptested for higher frequencies with a signal generator and an oscilliscope. A c-band lnb converts the signal to the 950-1450 mhz range. Not sure exactly what freq. is involved with dss, but i'm sure it is close to the same. The weatherproof connectors are effective if you use the ones with the built-in grommets and tighten them an extra 1/8 to 1/4 turn after fingertight. Applying silicone or tape to the outside of the connector usually makes matters worse in that it traps the moisture within.

[rocketmangb]

i have had good luck using a di-electric compound in the connectors.

Rocketman

[SMOKER]

I, at one time, used to get those grease filled fittings, but they went away due to costs.All of the cable companies use a snap and seal type now that seals when you attach them.TWC uses a two piece fitting Charter and ATT use a one piece fitting.Maybe you could stop your local installer NOT the company truck , but the guy with the ratty truck,and have him put your fittings on.They take special tools ,so its not usually cost effictive to get them yourself to do just a few fittings.Just an idea on cost for tools,$28 for the stripper and $68 for the crimper.

[GhostDog]

Originally posted by hifiaudio2
has anyone seen any differences between regular RG-6 and a "broadband " rated RG-6? I don;t mind paying a premium if it will help performance in any way. Thanks..


Personally, I dont even see much of a difference b/w rg59 and rg6, especially when using S-video...

Dime

[smack]

Snap & Seal connectors are the best way to go. The tool is about US$50.00, the connectors are 35 to 50 cents apiece, sold in bags of 100.

Use the leftovers to make christmas present cables for your family and friends.

Listen to Mr. Cellular, he's 100% correct and has a gun-toteing squirrel that'll come to get you if you don't listen.....

FWIW

Scott

[thejewell]

BTW, a little Coax-Seal tape will do wonders with the connectors over the long haul.

[SMOKER]

Hey cellular, dont pick on us cable guys...We haven't used RG59 for a few years now.We are now replacing it now as we go along when customers upgrade to digital service, as it , 9 out of 10 times, causes pixulation.

[SMOKER]

Just another note on different types of cable, guys there is a few different types of cable to consider.Just any good RG6 will get your system up and running but, how long will it last, is the question.I suggest a UV protected cable from the house mounts to the ground blockand even in that case, never lay it across your shingels, as it has a tendacy to deteriarate faster. For underground, make sure that it's flooded cable to the ground block to keep the water out.Once inside the house you can use just about any type of RG6 as long as it isnt subject to very damp conditions, such as dirt floors and regular flooding. I see cable that turns to powder all day long. As i have said in the past, it won't happen all at once,just a little at a time until one day you start thinking you have an IRD problem becuse the picture just isn't what it used to be.AS far as useing grease in your fittings, the sun cooks it out and water will get in.I've been in the cable biz for 16 years and see it all.I may not Have the answers that cellular can give you on the heavy tech stuff, but I do know cable.
And cellular,now there are a few new kids on the block(Direct TV and Dish) we had to get faster in self defense.Most of the DISH buy backs we do would be avoided if the installers hade the same high standerds you have, and installed it right the first time.

[Blaster]

Are you fricken kidding me?

Go to your local counter man and ask "Excuse me sir, is your ComScope wire UV rated?" -hehe

Where do you guys come up with this stuff? RG11 for 150ft runs, UV only rated RG6 for outdoor use, COME ON! Get real! 99% of all this is gobbelty gook.

Just use decent wire & ends (stay out of Radio Shack :) ), flood the outdoor connections, tighten them well, treat your wire carefully and you'll be just FINE (yes, even for years to come)

I've put up Lots of DBS systems since 96 and they're all problem free without any of this nonsense. (OK, a few of them had trees that I was shooting over grow taller and had to be moved ;) )

[SMOKER]

Blaster, I see by your posts that you must be an expert installer and probly one of the main reasons why the cable companies are so successful in thier dish buyback program.I havent yet delt with a customer that installed his own dish and traded it in.They were all dealer (jobber) installed by fine open minded installers like yourself. Remember, we dont all live in those ideal climates like you do and believe it or not some places actually do have bright sun and cold weather.I guess people, you can follow anyones advice here ,its up to you.And by the way blaster ,a good supplier of materials will have flooded and UV protected cable.Of course I'm sure yours dosent.

[Blaster]

SMOKER - while you're not indulging in your namesake, please take a minute to think of what you (and others) are doing to the first timer who comes here and is either having trouble getting signal -

MUST be because he's ONLY using RG6 on that 200ft run

OR he's getting ready to do a self install and you "book learned, engineers" have now sent him out looking for-

Snap & Seal connectors for his UV rated RG11 :D

Look, I'm well aware that Every installer thinks "my way is the best way, the ONLY way" whether he's installing car stereos, vinyl siding, or Horizon-to-Horizon circulary polarized Cband international feed 16 footers ;) BUT... come down off your high horse and give these guys a break! Your "theoretical necessities" are giving the wrong impressions that there's some "special" equipment and supplys needed to put up their own system. THIS AIN'T BRAIN SURGERY ;) and a completely viable, long lasting, installation can be completed by most people with ordinary tools and supplys (just gonna take them a little longer)

So, I just wanted to say to the regular guy, you CAN do without all this stuff and you're Not going to have trouble in a year or two if you don't do a commerical installation and use things like RG11 and UV rated wire - that's all ;)

[SMOKER]

Blaster ,I agree that it is possible to get it up and running your way in alot of cases, but I came from the old school of do it right the first time and never do it again.Is it possible to do 200 foot runs with Rg6? Yes it is .If you have everything perfect,and you use a good RG6 wire.I have to assume that anyone who is making a 200 foot run is the homeowner and wants it to last.With winter here soon,the bigger the wire ,the less resistance to cold.Remember there is electric feeding that LNB and it needs all of the help it can get.Your right, this isnt brain surgery, but if someone understood this as you and I do, they wouldnt be here asking for help.If someone is setting their unit up for a rental unit for a short period anything will work.With todays changing technology, even you and I dont know what will be needed in the future, so if I'm going to give advice here Its going to be the best I can give.If someone chooses to go another route, its their choice. I have 68 employees in three states that make a living fixing hack work. Six of them are QC inspectors making sure my guys do picture perfect work. I feel there is a need for quality work and quality information. What if down the road there is no forum for people to ask why their dish isnt working.If they do it right now they won't have to ask.Lets also address the costs of material here.With the costs of emulators, programers ect , is the cost of good wire really alot? Not hardly. A few less beers one night will cover the difference.By the way my name sake comes from drag racing and comeing out of the bleach box.Also, I started in this business as an installer, crawling through attics and dirt crawl spaces. Not as an engineer.

[Blaster]

SMOKER - you're still implying though that with RG6 "it is possible to get it up and running" as if it's not quite "right". I disagree... Today with everybody going for both sats, longer runs are becoming the norm. In todays "luxury homes", where going HiDef is a must, you're often either on the roof, or on a pole in the yard a 100ft away. You can easily have 125ft of cable by the time you get to the miltiswitch (from the dish, across a 70ft ridge, down three stories to the sw) and from there, the farthest set would easily have 100ft of wire going to it. I just haven't seen Any difficulties so far. I also believe (against common opinion) that RG59 is perfectly suitable, as long as it's in good shape, for satellite. And I've Had to use it several times and really don't see what the big deal is. I'm sure RG6 would have worked better. I'd prefered to use it if I could, but by How Much - really? In the real world is an 92 signal Really that much better than 80? I don't think so...

I'm just as much of an advocate of "doing it right the first time" as you are, our definition of "right" is just at question. If it works and continues to work for the life of the system, then it's done "right". It is suitable for purpose it was intended.

As for special "outdoor" RG6, from my personal experience, My C band systems coax shows No sign of cracking, caulking, or deteriorating in any way. It's been bakeing in the sun, on the roof, for almost 20yrs now. Until you mentioned it, I have never even seen any UV ratings on coax, not even in catalogs where I just looked, Perfect 10, Belden wire, ect.. Are you sure you aren't being sold a bill-of-goods here? Do YOU buy directional coax too? :) (you know what P.T. Barnum said -hehe)

I'm sure we can ALL agree that RG11 is TOTALLY unnecessary for 150ft run (that's what Really caught my attention and got me started down this road ;) )

[SMOKER]

BLASTER here is a site to back up the numbers that i'm refering to , so you can see the losses on different size coax www.askacom.com
Now if someone has a 150 foot run exterior,where the rg11 is used,and another 20 to 100 feet in the house, then its going start to loose signal.As far as that 80 signal you mention,remember that again not every one here lives in an area that can get that to start with. there are at least four countries posting here. Very seldom do I see where they are posting from, or I could give them better advice, so unless they say ,I generalize it.Now ,do I use directional wire,NO, I use the wire supplied by the three multi billion dollar companies that I subcontract for.No they aren't satallite companies. When sats first came out , I jumped on the wagon and sold and installed systems, until they started to give units and installs away and couldnt compete. Getting back to the real issue here is what is going to work for that average guy putting up his first and only unit.If you tell them RG59 will be perfectly good, someone will use it and the other 50 people who read the thread that truely have a distance issue and never posting a question, will see it and think that its ok for them also.The average install here dosent have perfectly cut fittings attached and have the dish aimed to the max. Now add that all to low grade wire and they start to have problems. Can you see where I'm going here.Any way enough with this thread. We have both made our cases and its up to the readers to make their choice.This isnt a pi--ing match, just trying to help and give good general advice.Just one more quick note here. The wire you used 20 years isn't the same wire out there now for the average installer. With the comm act of 1996 it opened up the door for alot of cheep materials to flood the market.The wire you used probly was a uv rated quad shield wire that was designed to last forever.